Board meeting with hunting dogs as a topic.

[Vidinha]

I don't know what this will be about exactly but I think it's worth checking out. Posted this in reguards to the presentation on the bottom of page ( # VI-B. ), It's in RED.

Aloha,
Cory


KAILUA NEIGHBORHOOD BOARD



KAILUA NEIGHBORHOOD BOARD NO. 31

REGULAR MEETING AGENDA

THURSDAY, MARCH 5, 2009

KAILUA RECREATION CENTER
21 SOUTH KAINALU DRIVE

NEW! Olelo Broadcast Channel 49 Tuesdays at 9:00 p.m.

Visit: http://www.neighborhoodlink.com for more information from the Kailua Neighborhood Board





I. CALL TO ORDER 7:00 P.M.



II. ANNOUNCEMENTS




Kailua Neighborhood Board places a donation box for board and community members at each meeting for non-perishable and canned foods as well as diapers and toilet tissue to distribute to appropriate service agencies.
















III. APPROVAL OF MINUTES 7:05 P.M.

Regular Meeting January 8, 2009



IV. AGENCY (AND OTHER) REPORTS 7:10 P.M.



A. Honolulu Fire Department (HFD) – Capt. Harold Ogata

B. Honolulu Police Department (HPD) – Lt. David Eber

C. Marine Corps Base Hawaii (MCBH) – Major Alan Crouch, USMC

D. Board of Water Supply (BWS)

E. Hawaii Pacific University (HPU) – Crystale Lopez



V. COMMUNITY ISSUES & ANNOUNCEMENTS 7:30 P.M.

Please sign in at meeting or complete community concern form or e-mail to:

prentissc001@hawaii.rr.com (Please limit comments to 2 minutes)



VI. PRESENTATIONS 7:40 P.M.



A. Condominium Property Regimen (CPR) Hawaii Revised Statutes Chapter 514 – How It Works by Department of Commerce and Consumer Affairs (DCCA) Real Estate Commission (10 Min)

B. Unregulated Use of Hunting Dogs in Hawaii – PowerPoint Presentation by Inga Gibson (Hawaii State Director, The Humane Society of the United States, Linda Vannatta (Citizens for Safe Hiking) (5 min)

[Koa Boa]

Aloha All,

Im posting the minutes of the mtg. Cory posted about in the above topic. its a bummer that the hunting community was not represented and the resolution passed right through with minimal opposition. I believe they are going to all neighborhood mtg's with thier presentation they are hoping to get some bills passed concerning the REGULATED use of hunting dogs.

I hope we can come together and stop this and at the same time stay calm and professional we need to be organized about this as they are to show them that there are two sides to the story and we are only asking to tell our side.

As far as I know this is on Oahu only but, who knows what they might do or go to next might be your island, or your very own neighborhood.

Aloha N Safe and Happy Huntin'

Muns

KAILUA NEIGHBORHOOD BOARD



DRAFT REGULAR MEETING MINUTES

THURSDAY, MARCH 5, 2009
KAILUA RECREATION CENTER



Unregulated Use of Hunting Dogs – Inga Gibson, the Hawaii Director from the Humane Society of the U.S. (HSUS), and Linda Vannatta, the founder of the Citizens for Safe Hiking (CSH), distributed a handout and covered the following items from their PowerPoint presentation:



1) CSH Mission – The mission of CSH is to advocate for the regulation of hunting dogs in Hawaii to provide a safer, more enjoyable environment for hikers and their pets, and promote more accountability regarding the treatment of hunting dogs.



2) Lack of Regulation and Enforcement Regarding Use of Hunting Dogs – Currently there is little regulation and enforcement regarding the use of hunting dogs in Hawaii. The State Department of Land and Natural Resources (DLNR) recommends that only two dogs per hunter be taken on a hunt, and that hunting dogs be leashed when on the hiking trails, but these recommendations are rarely followed. The majority of pig hunters in Hawaii use unleashed hunting dogs, and in the excitement of the chase these unleashed dogs can cover vast areas, and do not always distinguish between wild and pet animals. A recent case on Kauai involving 80 dogs demonstrates the need for regulation of hunting dogs. Policymakers and reputable hunters should support regulations, including an ethical code of conduct.



3) Trail Rules – The Manoa and Kuliouou ridge trails are two of the most popular hiking trails in Honolulu. Hunting with dogs is allowed on these trails during the weekends when most hikers are present. It's believed that hunting with unleashed hunting dogs and recreational hiking with leashed dogs are not compatible activities. DLNR recognizes the danger to hikers and their pets so they post warning signs at the trail head recommending that hikers with pets use other trails during hunt periods, but 37 out of 40 public hiking trails on Oahu allow hunting with dogs, which makes it difficult for hikers with dogs to find a place to hike. The Maunawili hiking trails in kailua are some of the few hiking trails that are off limits to hunters, but hunters and their dogs are still present; in fact, a hiker was bitten in an attack by dogs, defending her pets from unleashed hunting dogs.



4) Hunters' Opinion – The Oahu Pig Hunters, supported by DLNR, recommend that hikers on Oahu leave their dogs at home. However, many of those who enjoy recreational hiking with pet dogs believe there must be another solution.



5) Abandonment of Hunting Dogs – The HSUS is particularly concerned with the welfare of both the dogs used in hunting and the wildlife pursued. It was noted that abandoned or lost dogs may be struck by vehicles. Often abandoned hunting dogs die as a result of starvation, dehydration, predation or exposure, or may burden local animal shelters that are left to care for them.



6) Poor Treatment of Hunting Dogs – Without adequate regulation and enforcement, some hunters treat their dogs inhumanely, more like hunting equipment than live beings, withholding the proper care and attention. Some do not give the dogs the care or attention they require and deserve, and keep these social animals in improper confinement (even tethering or chaining) the majority of their lives, with little or no exercise outside the hunting season. Both the U.S. Department of Agriculture and the American Veterinary Medical Association condemn the practice of tethering or chaining dogs for long periods of time. The HSUS is concerned about the welfare of all dogs, pet and hunting dogs.

7) Training of Hunting Dogs – Animal welfare concerns originate even before the hounds reach the field – there are many training practices that place dogs in unnecessary danger of injury or death, and result in the torment and death of wildlife. Hunters often teach "bloodlust" by allowing dogs to tear apart small or young animals, believing this will make them more aggressive during the hunt. During the hunt, hunting dogs may be maimed or killed during the hunt.



Pros and Cons of Hunting with Dogs – The pros of hunting include fun, food, and exercise; however the cons include abuse and neglect of hunting dogs, dogs killed or maimed by game animals or left behind. Other consequences have been that game animals are brutally killed or pets near popular hiking trails are injured or killed by unleashed hunting dogs.

9) Solution – The State needs requirements for the use, training, identification, registration and keeping of hunting dogs, to ensure humane treatment.



10) Financial Burden – In addition to animal suffering, local humane societies and taxpayers bear the financial burden of such irresponsible hunters.


11) House Concurrent Resolution 60 (HCR 60) – HCR 60 states: Be It Resolved by the House of Representatives of the Twenty-fifth Legislature of the State of Hawaii, Regular Session of 2009, the Senate concurring, That the University of Hawaii at Manoa, College of Social Science, Public Policy Center and Spark M. Matsunaga Institute for Peace and Conflict Resolution are requested to convene a working group to explore the safe use of hunting dogs on public hiking trails; and Be It Further Resolved That the working group should include in the dialogue representatives from: (1) DLNR; (2) HPD; (3) Citizens for Safe Hiking; (4) Hawaiian Trail and Mountain Club; (5) Hawaii Dog Foundation; (6) Hawaiian Humane Society; (7) The Humane Society of the U.S.; ( The Nature Conservancy; (9) The Sierra Club, Hawaii Chapter; (10) Hawaii Hunting Association; and (11) Oahu Pig Hunters Association.



Questions, comments and concerns followed:



1) Dialogue with Hunters – Although there has been no direct contact with hunters by CSH or HSUS, the goal is to bring everyone together to discuss the issue. The HSUS is not opposed to hunting, only to egregious hunting and hunting that lacks sportsmanship; they are not opposed to the responsible use of hunting dogs.



2) Government's Lack of Response – Government agencies were found to be unhelpful and unresponsive on these issues with hunting dogs.



3) Hunting Trails Not for Pets – It was expressed that pets don't belong on hunting trails, and that pig hunters provide a public service by eliminating excess feral pigs. Some of the dogs deemed to be abandoned hunting dogs may be wild and not from the pig hunters.



4) Abandoned Hunting Dogs – Many of the abandoned dogs are litters of hunting dogs; in fact, the humane society receives many abandoned hunting dogs.



5) Solutions – A solution may be to require a registration and identification process for hunting dogs, and maybe there should be different hours for use of hiking trails to help reduce conflict.



6) Bill to Ban Eating Dogs – The bill to ban the eating of dogs was deferred for this session.



The motion related to safe use of hunting dogs on public trails (agenda item IX. Motion 1) was brought up at this time, without objection.



BOARD ACTIONS [1]:



Government and Community Services Committee (GCS) [1] –



Motion 1 [1]: GCS Chair moved that the Kailua Neighborhood Board No. 31 supports House Concurrent Resolution 60 (HCR 60) Requesting the University of Hawaii at Manoa, College of Social Sciences, Public Policy Center and Spark M. Matsunaga Institute for Peace and Conflict Resolution to Convene a Working Group to Explores the Safe Use of Hunting Dogs on Public Hiking Trails. Discussion ensued:



1) Support for HCR 60 – The Hawaii Kai Neighborhood Board No. 1 fully supported the concept of HCR 60. It was suggested for HSUS and CSH to meet with hunting associations; HCR 60 recommends a sit-down meeting with them along with other agencies in order to work together to find a solution. The final product is in the mediation style, with recommendations reported to the legislature; it's hoped the recommendations will include changes to the Hawaii Administrative Rules (HAR) or HRS. Pig hunters are well established lobbyists; they will be involved and could overpower the opposition; experienced mediators will be required.



2) Complicated Issue – It's a complicated issue, since hikers' dogs may start the dog fight by barking at the hunting dogs. Often people using hiking trails don't follow the signs, both hikers and hunters.



3) Presentation from the Other Side – Some Board members expressed reservations about the motion, since the hunting side was not also presented.



4) Experience with Hunting Dogs – Examples of good and bad experiences with hunting dogs were shared.



The motion that the Kailua Neighborhood Board No. 31 supports House Concurrent Resolution 60 (HCR 60) Requesting the University of Hawaii at Manoa, College of Social Sciences, Public Policy Center and Spark M. Matsunaga Institute for Peace and Conflict Resolution to Convene a Working Group to Explores the Safe Use of Hunting Dogs on Public Hiking Trails, was ADOPTED 14-3-0 (AYE: Bartley, Best, Bryant-Hunter, Chinen, Corcoran, Correa, Enos, Glanstein, Prentiss, Retherford, Tomasa, Ure, Weinberg, Wong; NO: Bratt, Fernandez, Lindgard).

[Nic Barca]

...It was a shame that the hunting community wasn't well represented at this meeting, but the minutes seemed relatively balanced, with the exception of Inga Gibson of HSUS and Linda Vannattas of CSH- Their choice of words boiled my blood a little.

We all know that encountering other dogs with your pack can be a problem when:
a) new dog is not used to socializing with a pack
b) an aggressive dogs starts something
c) the pack gangs up on another dog.

I don't know the rules on Oahu in regards to dogs on trails, but surely a rule to have your dogs leashed on the hiking trail is a simple step in the right direction; enforcing the rule is another matter. It's a shame that it may be coming to this, but perhaps it is time for the hunting community to regulate its self, under pressure. I'll admit that there are bad apples which need either weeding out or help to shape up their act or else we all suffer.

Just to throw out ideas, I believe I heard something about how in New Zealand, you cannot hunt pigs with dogs unless you are a member of a hunting club and that the club regulates themselves in that, your dogs must be certified to not attack sheep or endangered birds, other dogs, etc.

This sucks but it's all well intended. I've seen aggressive dogs which were good hunters, which the owners loved and would never get rid of despite their constant disobedience and fighting. Should we tolerate such dogs? Should we tolerate people who let them become that way? For it is those sorts of irresponsibleness which ruins in for everyone. And we all are to blame for turning a blind eye.

Ideally, we aught to weed out or give special training to pig dogs which:
1) target livestock and other non-target animals
2) act aggressive towards people
3) act aggressive towards other dogs

Then we could also weed out or preferably help out those owners who:
1) abuse/mistreat dogs (often in the eye of the beholder)
2) neglect their dogs (by choice or necessity)
3) need help or education in dog training
4) need better kenneling facilities.

Just my thoughts...

[HYPA]

THIS IS B,S AND THEY CAN SHOVE IT UP THERE A.S,THEY KNOW NOTHING ABOUT THE SPORT BUT YET THEY WRITE LIKE THEY HAVE DONE IT ALL , BUNCH A BORED TREE HUGGERS AND NOW THAT THE FERRY IS GONE THIS WILL BE IN THERE POW WOWS NOW.



AND LOOK WERE THEY BROUGHT IT UP FIRST .......KAILUA!!!.....TRY RUN ONE OF THOSE STYLE MEETINGS HERE IN DA COUNTRY AND WATCH THAT SHAT GET SLAPPPED RIGHT OUT THE DOOR ALONG WIT THE HAOLES....... NEVA HERD OFF RENAGADE HUNTING DOGS IN KAILUA MUST HAVE CAUGHT DOGS RUNNIN THROUGH THOSE HAOLI COMMUNITIES DISTURBING THE PEACE.....WHAT A BUNCH OF CROCK


FREAKEN PUBLIC HAS NOTHING BETTER TO COMPLAIN ABOUT......HUMANE SOCIETY TOO!!!!

[Lyle B]

They've gone to far! First, banning pocket knives, secondly, trying to ban pitty's, now trying to ban hunting dogs. Those are bunch of Liberals trying to tell us how to live and what we can do or can't. There's also a Hawaii bill out there that they are trying to allow same sex marriage in the state of Hawaii. Hunting hogz this is part of people hertiage and tradition that has been pass down from generation to generation. What next, no bow and arrow. Instead why don't they try stopping our Ice Epidemic on all the islands, something really serious. Bunch of damn Liberals who don't appreciate the outdoors! Anyways that's my 2 cents.

Braddah Cory, jus shot a bunch of recurve the other day and so hooked. So much fun, now jus gotta find her!


Aloha, Lyle

[Misadventure Gear]

Not to hijack this thread, but did the pocket knife ban go through? I thought it was shot down.....

[Nic Barca]

It passed first reading and was last refered to the Hawaii Senate Committee on Judiciary and Government Operations (JGO) on January 26th. It has since been over a month with no change in status. I'm pretty clueless to law so if anybody can explain to me what this means, I'ld much appreciate it.

The committee is made up of old timers, if that makes anybody feel better. Members include Senators Brian T. Taniguchi (chair), Dwight Y. Takamine (vice-chair), Robert Bunda, Mike Gabbard, Clarence K. Nishihara, and Sam Slom. Here's a link: juditiary and Government Operations Commitee
It might not be to late to contact them.

[Vidinha]

HUNTERS: this is the letter of testimony that submitted by a friend. ALL are WELCOME to copy it, add personal statements, your name/contact info and sent it to:
hretestimony@capitol.hawaii.gov
sens@capitol.hawaii.gov
reps@capitol.hawaii.gov
DO THIS TONIGHT OR FIRST THING IN THE MORNING CAUSE THEY ARE HEARING THE BILL THURSDAY APRIL 23!



Dear Chairs and Madam Chairs,


As an outdoor enthusiast, avid hiker, dog owner and hunter I strongly oppose resolution HCR 60 and I ask you to do the same.

HCR 60 states that "hunting dogs are trained to aggressively pursue all animals, without distinction between wild animals and pet dogs." This statement is FALSE. Hunting dogs are just as trainable as pet dogs, but it is the responsibility of the hunter to teach his/her dogs the difference between 'prey' and 'friend'. My dogs are trained from a very young age to avoid livestock.

HCR 60 also states that "lost, injured, and neglected hunting dogs at times end up at local animal shelters without any permanent identification, making it difficult to reunite them with their owners and generating additional expenses for taxpayers" While this is true the statement is equally true for pet dogs, infact the number of stray/non-hunting dogs in a shelter at any given time is far greater than 'hunting' dogs.

HCR 60 recomends "a dialogue among the various groups that are affected by the presence of hunting dogs on public hiking trails". HCR 60 recommends 11 groups to be included in the working group, only 2 represent the hunting community while the majority of the remaining groups are known to have an anti-hunting stance.

In a presentation to the Kailua Neighborhood Board, Linda Vannatta, of Citizens for Safe Hiking admitted that "there had been no direct contact with hunters" regarding this issue. In the same presentation, Vannatta stated that "37 of 40 public hiking trails on Oahu allow hunting with dogs". While DLNR/Na Ala Hele recognizes 40 trails, they list only 12 as hunting access trails, all other hiking trails are outside of public hunting units. It is common knowledge that there are far more than 40 trails on Oahu which are open to hiking but are not recognized by state agencies.

In conclusion I would like to say that I oppose HCR 60 because the information presented to the Neighborhood Boards and within the resolution itself is incomplete, poorly researched, baiased and false in the eyes of ethical hunters. I strongly oppose resolution HCR 60 and I ask you to do the same.



Sincerly,

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